On guns and liberals

[mcroft]

immlass wrote about a local response to gun ownership that seemed overly het-up.

When I lived in Houston, I listened to KPFT, a station whose parent was originally started by pacifists during WWII (yes, there were some). KPFT used to do things like make enemies out of the Klan (who bombed their tower off the air) and my favorite local bar (who thought they were high-handed idiots).

On one sunny summer afternoon, some KPFT interview show was interviewing a woman who ran a rape-crisis hotline training center. Trainees would come to her facility to be trained in how to cope with women who called in to talk to someone about being raped. The facility was in rural Alabama and the woman happened to be a lesbian.

Some part of what she did (either with or for other women) offended her neighbors. She was threatened and the police were not helpful. Someone dumped a dead dog at her mailbox.

"Do you think something might actually happen?" asked the host.

"Oh, yes," replied the woman. "We've had people shoot onto our property."

"Oh, my God!," said the interviewer. "Do you at least have guns of your own?"

"Of course we do!" said the woman, almost indignant that the question would be asked.

And that, my friends, is the difference between southern liberals and northern liberals. Gun ownership is not abstract. It is about protecting ourselves from those who don't care that we're doing something legal that don't like.

Comments

[greeneyes-rpi.livejournal.com]

Um...what does "het up" mean?

[mcroft.livejournal.com]

agitated

[la-directora.livejournal.com]

I don't see what southern and northern have to do with it. I am a native Texan. Lived there for the first 27 years of my life. And I disliked guns then as much as I do now, and was as unlikely to personally own one then as I am now. Nor do I believe in personal conceal/carry laws. My mom, a lifelong Southerner and more than 50 year Texan, feels the same way.

I have to admit that I can't recall a single pro-gun liberal that I've met north of the Mason-Dixon line. But I know plenty of liberals south of that same line who aren't likely to own guns to protect themselves.

[dirkcjelli.livejournal.com]

"Not acting as a deterrent, but I like having it anyway."

[princejvstin.livejournal.com]

I probably should learn to fire a gun, someday. Minnesota is a liberal state, but is "Southern" in its attitudes toward guns, given the strong hunting culture here.

[gentlyepigrams]

I don't own a gun, either to protect myself or for recreational shooting, because I can't devote the time and energy to keep in practice or to properly maintain a gun. I don't like or dislike guns, but I'm not scared of them and I'm not scared of people who own them. I'm not pro-gun or anti-gun, just anti-ignorant-fear-of-guns.

I've always suspected (ignorant) fear of guns is frequently an old-line urban issue, and that's why Northeasterners are more prone to it. People who pack themselves into cities like sardines are more likely to deal with only the negative consequences of stupid gun owners: not just gun crime, which happens everywhere, but, frex, random gun deaths from people shooting in the air. Proper training on how to use a gun and proper respect for your gun and its capacity for hurting people should keep most people from shooting in the air. (So would better science education. Bullets that go up must come down.)

[la-directora.livejournal.com]

I guess I'm not understanding you. I read statistics on guns for years while living in Texas, and the statistics bore out that more people were injured by guns in their own home than were injured by criminals. And I'm sure it colors my opinion on the matter to have a great-uncle who killed his brother with a gun when he was a child (they were playing with it while the parents weren't home), but this sort of thing happens fairly frequently.

I don't know if not wanting that to happen in my home is "ignorant" fear or not. And I guess I'm still not seeing a northern vs southern thing. Do gun ownership and attitudes about guns present a geographic bias?

[gentlyepigrams]

My experience is that gun ownership attitudes are significantly different between (urban) Yankees and (suburban/rural) Southerners/Westerners. Keep in mind that by Eastern seabord standards, there's almost no such thing as an urban area east of the Mississippi. Houston, for instance, doesn't have the urban density of an east-coast city for all that it's one of the most populated metro areas in the country. I haven't done the statistical research, but I did say that it was an opinion. YMMV, in particular for self-selection. Geography is not destiny, though: the most "pro-gun" person I've ever met, and I use that term advisedly because I object to it, was born and raised in the New York City metro area.

I'm a firm believer in proper gun care and storage, which does not include allowing children free access to guns. I also have a personal story about an improperly-stored gun that doesn't end up with anybody dead, but convinced me that I would only own a gun if I could take care of it and keep in practice. I'm not willing to tell other people not to own or use guns because I don't want to do the work myself, though.

[mcroft.livejournal.com]

Yes, geographic location is one of the known differences.

From the introductory paragraphs of a study of attitudes towards gun control.

Generally, recent polls show that the public is in favor of stricter gun control laws (Moore & Newport, 1994; PR Newswire, 2000). While the public as a whole supports stricter gun control laws, differences in attitudes concerning gun control have been noted. For instance, past research indicates that differences in attitudes towards gun control exist on several overlapping levels including region of country, gentler, race, urbanization, familiarity with guns, and weapons training classes. Mom specifically, research indicates the following regarding gun control:

* There are regional differences with Southerners more prone to opposing gun control than individuals from other regions of the country, although some evidence suggests that the regional differences are exaggerated (Brennan, Lizzotte, & McDowall, 1993; Livingston & Lee, 1992; Mauder, 1990; Moore & Newport, 1994; Mundt, 1990).

* Males are more likely to oppose gun control than females are (Ellison, 1991; Kauder, 1993; Livingston & Lee, 1992; Marciniak & Loftin, 1991; Moore & Newport, 1994; Tyler & Lavrakas, 1983; Webster, Gainer & Champion, 1993).

* Whites are more likely to oppose gun control efforts than are blacks (McClain, 1983; Secret & Johnson, 1989).

* Those who live in urban counties are more likely to support gun control efforts than those who live in rural counties (Boor & Blair, 1990; Kauder, 1994; Price, Desmond, & Smith, 1991).

* Those who are familiar with guns are more likely to oppose gun control than those who are not familiar with guns (Ellison, 1991; Hill, Howell, & Driver, 1985; Lizotte, Tesoriero, Thornberry, & Krohn, 1994; Rosen, 2000; Tyler & Lavrakas, 1983).

* Those who have head weapons safety classes are more opposed to gun control than those who have not (Livingston & Lee, 1992).

None of this research is really surprising, and the Southern/white/rural/male/gun-using group does tend to be politically powerful.

[avram]

I can't recall a single pro-gun liberal that I've met north of the Mason-Dixon line.

Have you visited New Hampshire or Vermont?

Hey, I support gun rights, and I'm a New Yorker and a liberal.

[bassfingers.livejournal.com]

Hmmm... Guns; KPFT... Reminds me of the time my band thought they were supposed to play on someone's radio show and the father of the gal on the air at the time opened the door to the station with his hand in the back waistband of his pants and told us to leave...

[mcroft.livejournal.com]

There was a shooting at KPFT recently. Just missed a DJ, apparently.

[mcroft.livejournal.com]

Yep. I hope neither immlass or I appeared to be saying that it was strictly a southern thing. However, there is a measurable difference in attitudes along geographic lines.

[djinnthespazz.livejournal.com]

And in Arizona...

Vice Mayor Dave Seibert is looking for a new way to fund the Silent Witness program and it involves the sale of weapons.

Nothing wrong with that picture in the Firefly universe, eh?